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Venice to rally for independence from Italy

published by Tom Sullivan on Sat, 2012-10-06 10:53

A mass rally is to be held on Saturday, calling for the region’s independence from Rome. A large majority of Venetians support the move as financial burdens from central government bite.

Indipendenza Veneta, a pro-independence movement, says it expects several thousand to attend the rally in the center of the city.

Recent surveys show that support for independence amongst locals is high and those in favor want a referendum. A poll conducted in September by Italian national newspaper, Corriere della Sera, found 80% wanted to separate from Rome.

A more recent poll by Il Gazzetino, a local newspaper, found a lower but still high level of support at 70%.

The Venetian province is wealthier than many others in Italy and many resent having to pay the bills for the rest of the country.

The lagoon city is following on the heels of European independence movements in Scotland and Catalonia. Both regions have strong separatist movements that believe they would be better off as small independent countries.

Source and full story: Russia Today, 06 Oct 2012

Tags: 
ITALY
PROTEST

Comments

Submitted by Tom Sullivan on Sat, 2012-10-06 10:55.

Just to clarify, the movement is seeking independence for territory of the former Venetian Republic, not just the city of Venice. This would include all the province of Veneto, much of Friuli and part of the Lombardia.

Submitted by Heydrich on Sat, 2012-10-06 16:17.

The Venetian province is wealthier than many others in Italy and many resent having to pay the bills for the rest of the country.

Just like Catalan in Spain. And like Catalan, I’ll bet the people of Venice want independence, but their politicians are staunchly pro-banker, and pro-Rome.

This is only the beginning. As the depression worsens, we will see more and more calls for independence around the world. Even the people in some U.S. states will call for independence from the USA.

All such moves will be crushed, but they will continue to grow in strength.

Incidentally, north Italy (Venice, Milan, etc) is very different in values and culture from south Italy (e.g. Naples). The main thing they have in common is the Italian language. Italy did not become unified into its modern form as a state until 1861. Germany did not become unified until 1871. The same factors that delayed unification will promote disunion as the depression worsens.

Submitted by andie531 on Sat, 2012-10-06 17:06.

Historically, the northerners have always resented the southerners.  Some areas north used to be part of the Austro Hungarian empire (both Venizia and Lombardy circa 1815 were part of it). Naples and Palermo are both obviously more impoverished than Milan.  I don't know the history behind this.  All I know is anyone with an IQ bigger than their hat size got out of s. Italy and moved to the US during the great migration circa 1900, and that includes my grandparents.

I've heard other things from Italians who took an interest in this - there was some oppression of poor southerners by rich northerners, etc.  I don't know all the details.

When I went to Italy the first time, someone there told me the standard joke, which is racist, but it'll give you an idea of how northerners think - "When Garibaldi united Italy, he divided Africa." 

Submitted by Tom Sullivan on Sat, 2012-10-06 20:04.

I've heard other things from Italians who took an interest in this - there was some oppression of poor southerners by rich northerners, etc.  I don't know all the details.

As far as I can tell, it isn't as simple as Northerners oppressing Southerners. Italy has a complex and somewhat factious history that is often difficult for an outsider to decipher. Its worlds away from being a single, united country. Campanilismo, the perrenial attachment to one's local area (literally to the bell tower of the local church, or Campanile) is still commonplace.

As you say, Italy has been conquered and colonised, not only by the Austro-Hungarian empire, but also by the Arabs, French (Bourbons) and Spanish. This and the fact that Italy was a diverse collection of small kingdom-states prior to unification has left it with quite a linguistic legacy. There are many languages (other than Italian) still in use in the country and many are officially recognised. These include Catalan, Croation, Franco-Provençal, French, Friulian, Gallurese, German, Greek, Ladin, Neapolitan–Calabrian, Occitan, Piedmontese, Sardinian, Sassarese, Sicilian, Slovene and Venitian. It seems that Alessandro Manzoni's goal of providing citizens of the newly formed Italian state with a national identity through a unified language has not yet been reached, even though the advent of mass media has signficantly reduced the usage of regional languages and dialects. 

The south of Italy, affectionately called il mezzogiorno (midday), has a number of factors working against it. For a start, there's the climate, the high midday temperatures having given the area its nickname. Then there's the often inhospitable terrain. Both don't easily lend themselves to the south's traditional business of agriculture, particularly as developments in the latter part of the last century pushed farmers more towards large-scale operations. Similarly, the inhospitable terrain isn't the best for industry and transport links. In contrast, the North, with its relatively flat terrain, more temperate climate and better transport links, tends to win out.

As the birth rate in the south outpaced that in the more prosperous North, migration was the only option for many people as there were precious few jobs and even fewer that were well-paid. The presence of the parasitical organised crime syndicates who collect pizzo (protection money) from business owners doesn't exactly encourage the establishment of industries that would provide those badly-needed jobs. 

While poverty is increasingly widespread throughout the entire country, the south is still significantly poorer than the north. Italy, the third-largest economy in Europe, has growing levels of poverty and holds the dubious record of having the highest levels of child poverty in Europe. 

Submitted by Heydrich on Sun, 2012-10-07 06:14.

"When Garibaldi united Italy, he divided Africa."

Ha! I had not heard this. Good one.

Sullivan writes,

“The south of Italy, affectionately called il mezzogiorno (midday), has a number of factors working against it. For a start, there's the climate, the high midday temperatures having given the area its nickname. Then there's the often inhospitable terrain…etc.

Yes, and climate affected how the Roman Empire worked. Summer was the time to plant and harvest. Winter was the season for wars on conquest. (Of course, wars also happened whenever foreign peoples revolted.)

While poverty is increasingly widespread throughout the entire country, the south is still significantly poorer than the north. Italy, the third-largest economy in Europe, has growing levels of poverty and holds the dubious record of having the highest levels of child poverty in Europe.

Yes, child labor is back in vogue in Italy. Ten-year-olds in some cases work ten hours a day. School is out of the question.

Also, because of the immigration to the USA from southern Italy, what most Americans think of as “Italian food” is basically southern Italian. Lots of pasta, cheese, and tomato sauce, heavy red wine, spicy sausage -- that sort of thing. In the USA, north Italian food is only available in expensive restaurants that specialize in it.

The north-south distinction is also evident in India and China. Even the USA. I have never been to the American south, and have no desire to visit it.

Submitted by andie531 on Sun, 2012-10-07 15:31.

"parasitical organised crime syndicates who collect pizzo (protection money):"

I looked up the names of the five NY crime families and three are possibly Jewish.  Capone is as well.  I wonder if the racket started before or after the great explusion from Spain in 1492.  Some of the migrants from Spain ended up with Italian names and left for S. America.  That's how we got Nancy Pelosi.

My mother said the Zionists had a racket going in our area (near NYC).  They'd go to Jewish businesses and demand money for Israel.  If they got a "no" the windows of the store would get busted sometime within a week or two.  The Italian loan sharks would sometimes target businesses to act as loan partners (car dealerships, for one).  If the business said no, there wouldn't be a backlash.  In essence. the Italian mafia was easier to deal with than the Zionists. 

Submitted by Heydrich on Mon, 2012-10-08 02:21.

My mother said the Zionists had a racket going in our area (near NYC).  They'd go to Jewish businesses and demand money for Israel.  If they got a "no" the windows of the store would get busted sometime within a week or two. 

And if any local newspaper mentioned this, the newspaper would no doubt attribute it to “anti-Semitism.” Sort of like the famous “Kristalnacht” in Nazi Germany, which was a Jewish false flag orchestrated by the ultra-violent Jewish LICRA gangsters in Paris (International League against Racism and Anti-Semitism), which still exists today, and is like the American ADL.

The Italian loan sharks would sometimes target businesses to act as loan partners (car dealerships, for one).  If the business said no, there wouldn't be a backlash.  In essence. the Italian mafia was easier to deal with than the Zionists.

When movies portray Italian (or Sicilian) mafias as violent, the movies are using antics that are often more appropriate to Jewish gangs. For example, the Genovese crime family (which inspired the “Godfather movies”) involved a lot of Jewish gangsters such as "Bugsy" Siegel. Movies that portray the early days of Las Vegas portray violent Italian mafiosi. Again, the Vegas mafiosi were mainly Jews.  During the Prohibition era (1920-33), the most violent of gangs was Jewish (e.g. the "Purple Gang.") In Cuba, organized crime was overseen by the Jew Meyer Lansky, who was tight with Charles "Lucky" Luciano.

And so on. Of course, Hollywood (controlled by Jews) downplays the Jewish gangster aspect.  Jews regard themselves as the most decent of all people, and regard all non-Jews as gangsters that commit “holocausts” against Jews. 

As far as Al Capone being Jewish, I'm seen conflicting claims on this.  I once read some pretty convincing information that he was Jewish, but I don't remember where I read that. I once spoke with an Italian from New York about this. He insisted that Capone was a Jew.

Submitted by andie531 on Mon, 2012-10-08 03:14.

From http://groups.yahoo.com/group/italianamericanpride/message/3324

Hi folks,

Take a look at names of Jews in Rome In the 1550's;

http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/yehoshua/rome_names.html

Now scroll down till you hit the name "Sabato di Benedetto Called
Capone!!!!"

So who's going to write to Mr Spielberg to explain this ground
breaking discovery? That Al Capone had Jewish roots! Mind you he had
no idea of his own ancestry but he did play the violin!

Gaetano

-----------------------------

List also includes

Sabato di Jeruham di Capone

-----------------------------------

Capone's sole respite from the pressures of running his business enterprises these days was the schvitz, a traditional Jewish steam bath.

--------------------------------

And John Gotti's son looks like a cross between Al Franken and Art Buchwald.

Submitted by Tom Sullivan on Mon, 2012-10-08 09:36.

Now scroll down till you hit the name "Sabato di Benedetto Called Capone!!!!

No surprise there. My own research has led me to the conclusion that the Genovese family are also Jewish, with the Gambini family also a likely candidate. Sicily's Jewish population ballooned after the expulsion of Jews from Spain.

Submitted by Heydrich on Wed, 2012-10-10 05:45.

And don't forget the explosion of Jews in places like Venice. Jews chose to live in their own Venetian quarter, which they called the "ghetto."

Jews voluntarily segregated themselves into ghettos (affluent Jewish quarters) throughout Europe. During WW II, Jews protected themselves by building walls around their quarters and posting Jewish guards at the entrances. The Germans were happy with this Jewish move, since it reduced friction between Jews and non-Jews. The Germans sometimes even had guards outside the ghettos to prevent non-Jews from entering and causing trouble for Jews. In Poland the Germans left Jewish quarters alone, unless Jews started engaging in terrorist activity.

Naturally wikipedia claims that Jews have always been "compelled" to live in their affluent sections of town.  

Submitted by Tom Sullivan on Mon, 2012-10-08 09:41.

Incidentally, the most famous "Irish" mafioso is Danny Greene, listed in Wikipedia as having Irish ancestors on both sides. However, the surname Greene is a typically Jewish surname and is definitely not Irish.  

Submitted by Heydrich on Wed, 2012-10-10 05:30.

Green can be Irish because of intermarriage with Brits, can't it? But you're right. Green is not a traditional Irish name, and Greene certainly isn't. Note the added ‘e’ on the end. Many Jews did this to their family names in the days when Jews were not universally beloved. Jews changed a letter as a code so they could recognize each other. Thus, Clark became Clarke, White became Whyte, Adams became Addams, Brown became Browne, and so on. Jews called this “Anglicization.” The formula is not foolproof (Clarke can sometimes be non-Jewish) but when a common name has an unconventional spelling, it is a red flag that further investigation is warranted.

When a Jews appeared on TV with names like Horowitz or Goldberg or Silverstein, my Irish Canadian mother would joke, “There’s a good Irish name for you.”

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